a while back i was getting points for amazon cards with my bing searches.
i wasnt even using bing that much even though it's pretty much better than google search sometimes. i wonder if they still do that.
Re: Re: BBS using Vista
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Mon Oct 05 2020 05:39 am
So its a feature which places artificial limitations on hardware, in order to support limitations on software?
And this is progress?
Windows needs to die a fiery death. Stallman was right about proprietary software.
it aint hurting anybody.
Re: Re: BBS using Vista
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Mon Oct 05 2020 05:39 am
So its a feature which places artificial limitations on hardware, in order to support limitations on software?
....no? It's a system to make reinstalls easy and that's about it? Windows h been tying license keys to hardware configs in some way for damn near 20 yea since XP and activation. Licenses keys CAN be migrated between systems if on needs to - the obvious requirement being that copy of Windows on that old hardware is no longer used.
I can't even begin to see what you mean about "artificial limitations on hardware" and barely find the software "limited" beyond the above which is purely enforcement of already existing licensing.
You may hate MS and Windows and that's fine - prefer what you wish - but don completely distort what something is to fit a personal agenda against something, especially when in practice the aspect you're trying to make a bi deal out of isn't anything new for the OS in question.
_____
Kurisu Yamato
www.xadara.com
--- MRO wrote ---
Windows needs to die a fiery death. Stallman was right about
proprietary software.
it aint hurting anybody.
fact. They've put the service into Xbox as well, so I even get points for gaming when I do.. you know, once a month now or so. >_>
Used to get free years of Xbox live with it. Now I get GamePass Ultimate. My friend still does the Amazon cards constantly. He always buys little crap with what he gets from them, so it's a win-win on his end, saving money where he can. :D
Windows needs to die a fiery death. Stallman was right about
proprietary software.
it aint hurting anybody.
Well, it hurts ME when it degrades due top regular operating system operation and I get relatives chasing me asking to fix it.
A lot like smartphones, actually.
I think his issue is that you have to perform operating system activation at all, automated or not.
i can tell that google search is going overboard with messing with people's search results so i may go back to bing or try to find something different.
i can tell that google search is going overboard with messing with people's search results so i may go back to bing or try to find something different.
Arelor wrote to Kurisu <=-
Re: Re: BBS using Vista
By: Kurisu to Dennisk on Fri Oct 16 2020 08:56 pm
Re: Re: BBS using Vista
By: Dennisk to Kurisu on Mon Oct 05 2020 05:39 am
So its a feature which places artificial limitations on hardware, in order to support limitations on software?
....no? It's a system to make reinstalls easy and that's about it? Windows h been tying license keys to hardware configs in some way for damn near 20 yea since XP and activation. Licenses keys CAN be migrated between systems if on needs to - the obvious requirement being that copy of Windows on that old hardware is no longer used.
I can't even begin to see what you mean about "artificial limitations on hardware" and barely find the software "limited" beyond the above which is purely enforcement of already existing licensing.
You may hate MS and Windows and that's fine - prefer what you wish - but don completely distort what something is to fit a personal agenda against something, especially when in practice the aspect you're trying to make a bi deal out of isn't anything new for the OS in question.
_____
Kurisu Yamato
www.xadara.com
I think his issue is that you have to perform operating system
activation at all, automated or not.
Specially because when you come from the Linux or BSD world, these
things feel very alien and intrusive. I mean, I have comercial software running on Linux and BSD servers but I never had to activate it with
codes or anything.
Then you have things like Autodesk. When I was at college they gave you
a free student license for engineering CAD software, but the activation process sucked so much that you ended up cracking the product instead.
So, well, activation procedures are a limit set on purpose by the manufacturer so he can make bucks more easily. So Dennisk has a point there. I don't have an _ethical_ problem with activation procedures,
but sometimes they suck so much they deserve to die by fire.
--
gopher://gopher.operationalsecurity.es
Re: Re: BBS using Vista
By: MRO to Kurisu on Sat Oct 17 2020 10:52 am
i can tell that google search is going overboard with messing with
people's search results so i may go back to bing or try to find
something different.
How about DuckDuckGo? DuckDuckGo says they value your privacy (if you believe them(.
i can tell that google search is going overboard with messing with people's search results so i may go back to bing or try to find somet different.
How about DuckDuckGo? DuckDuckGo says they value your privacy (if you believe t hem(.
the doctor wrote to NIGHTFOX <=-
Keys built into the BIOS. That's why, at work, I can rebuild a Dell laptop and just install Windows on it, without entering any keys...
Interesting. I guess mine have always been activated automatically with
the UEFI keys. I don't think I've ever had to actually type an activation
code for Windows 10.
What is a UEFI key? I'm not familiar with that. Typically I build my own desktop PC and buy an OEM copy of Windows, where I have to enter a license key, or I might buy a laptop which already has Windows installed on it.
So its a feature which places artificial limitations on hardware, in
order to support limitations on software?
And this is progress?
Windows needs to die a fiery death. Stallman was right about
proprietary software.
Yeah, the fact it also links to the MS account is just awesome! Forgot to mention that in my post, but yeah. MS accounts are so bloody useful... about like an Apple account but, you know, for Microsoft stuff! haha...
Hey it ties in with my Xbox and that's all that matters. :P
a while back i was getting points for amazon cards with my bing searches.
i wasnt even using bing that much even though it's pretty much better than google search sometimes. i wonder if they still do that.
Well, it hurts ME when it degrades due top regular operating system operation and I get relatives chasing me asking to fix it.
A lot like smartphones, actually.
Yes, kind of. The problem isn't specifically UEFI, it is Secure Boot
which can place an impediment on people. Granted in the majority of
cases, the user has control, and I do admit it can also be advantageous, although personally I don't think so.
Except when you have a personal, and office account and need to access
your office account's MS Office software on your machine setup with your personal account, and the Office registration/activation goes a little wonky...
Tracker1 wrote to Dennisk <=-
On 10/5/2020 3:39 AM, Dennisk wrote:
So its a feature which places artificial limitations on hardware, in
order to support limitations on software?
No... there are no artificial limitations on hardware, it's just a key
in the bios that stores the registration key for windows on that
device, you can always use a different key at install or change it for
a different windows version.
And this is progress?
In terms of user convenience, absolutely... it allows a fast path to a clean windows install over trying to clear out bloatware after the
fact.
Windows needs to die a fiery death. Stallman was right about
proprietary software.
While I mostly agree, Windows really doesn't bother me *that* much
these days... I find the forced update/restart somewhat annoying, but
on the flip side of having had to support some friends and family, I'd rather they were always updated/current on their software in general.
It's not like the average computer user could handle even a major dist upgrade when errors do happen, even if they stuck to LTS releases. Of course appImage/flatpak/snap can help with that, but I'm guessing
you're also opposed to those as well.
Tracker1 wrote to Dennisk <=-
On 10/5/2020 8:43 AM, Dennisk wrote:
Yes, kind of. The problem isn't specifically UEFI, it is Secure Boot
which can place an impediment on people. Granted in the majority of
cases, the user has control, and I do admit it can also be advantageous, although personally I don't think so.
My only real issue with Secure Boot, is when you can't disable it as
has happened with some MS (and Intel) hardware specifically.
On 10/17/2020 3:06 AM, Arelor wrote:
Well, it hurts ME when it degrades due top regular operating system operat and I get relatives chasing me asking to fix it.
A lot like smartphones, actually.
So you've *NEVER* had dist upgrade fail on you, or create error
conditions in software you use? Or had hardware regressions, or other
odd behaviors... Or had to switch to a beta/dev kernel to support
hardware to work around previously mentioned issues and then had other things break as a result?
No imagine trying to troubleshoot/fix *THAT* over the phone.
--
Michael J. Ryan
tracker1 +o Roughneck BBS
Well, one reason to bother is that you're breaking the law
How....... juvenile.
Tracker1 wrote to Kurisu <=-
Except when you have a personal, and office account and need to access your office account's MS Office software on your machine setup with
your personal account, and the Office registration/activation goes a little wonky...
Tracker1 wrote to Arelor <=-
So you've *NEVER* had dist upgrade fail on you, or create error
conditions in software you use? Or had hardware regressions, or other
odd behaviors... Or had to switch to a beta/dev kernel to support
hardware to work around previously mentioned issues and then had other things break as a result?
No imagine trying to troubleshoot/fix *THAT* over the phone.
On 10/16/2020 7:19 PM, MRO wrote:
a while back i was getting points for amazon cards with my bing
searches. i wasnt even using bing that much even though it's pretty
much better than google search sometimes. i wonder if they still do
that.
Which is funny, considering Bing used Google search to train it's systems.
I'm all for a good package management system. I just don't think the options you cited are good systems. They solve the wrong problem.
Are you able to generate your own BIOS key?
My only real issue with Secure Boot, is when you can't disable it as
has happened with some MS (and Intel) hardware specifically.
That is the big concern I have. It's one step from it being an option to disable, to it not being available. And there are many arguments that companies can make to disable it, or at least make their OS refuse to boot if it is disabled.
So you've *NEVER* had dist upgrade fail on you, or create error
conditions in software you use? Or had hardware regressions, or other
odd behaviors... Or had to switch to a beta/dev kernel to support
hardware to work around previously mentioned issues and then had other
things break as a result?
Now imagine trying to troubleshoot/fix *THAT* over the phone.
Honestly I don't get the fear of distro upgrades in small systems.
I have never had a dist upgrade fail on a consumer system.
I had one hardware regression - propietary kernel module which had to be replaced because the manufacturer stopped supporting new kernels - in a consumer system.
I have faced some breakage on non-consumer systems with database migrations and
such, but then 1) this does not apply to consumers and 2) that is why production systems have failovers and switchovers and testing environments.
Main office in the clinic is running Linux workstations only. I currentl¤y support ONE Windows install, which is my mother's. About 70% or the support phone calls I get are for Window's problems.
So, hmm, you are not exactly scaring me a lot with Linux dist upgrade failures.
Heck, I don't remember an OpenBSD os upgrade failure either, and those used to
involve a lot of manual work.
Had the issue a few days ago... on a loaner/temp laptop for work, andExcept when you have a personal, and office account and need to access
your office account's MS Office software on your machine setup with
your personal account, and the Office registration/activation goes a
little wonky...
I haven't run into that, and I have both a work and personal account
loaded up; I need to in order to load a personal OneNote notebook with
tech notes in it along with my work notebook with meeting notes.
Tracker1 wrote to Dennisk <=-options
On 10/19/2020 7:33 PM, Dennisk wrote:
I'm all for a good package management system. I just don't think the
you cited are good systems. They solve the wrong problem.
While I understand, that said the full package systems like flatpak
allow for dependencies to not be an issue and for complex application sthat can be a big problem, especially with a distro upgrade, which
always blows up something in my experience.
Are you able to generate your own BIOS key?
I'm not sure tbh, I'm not really familiar with how the backend for it works, or if it's a general (U)EFI firmware feature.
While I understand, that said the full package systems like flatpak
allow for dependencies to not be an issue and for complex application
sthat can be a big problem, especially with a distro upgrade, which
always blows up something in my experience.
These can be solved with better discipline and standards though. As much as I
like Linux, Windows has an advantage here. Having that central control means that there is a better chance that you develop for one specific platform and have it work.
Flatpak means that Linux has failed as a platform. If you can't develop a program for that platform, without having to include a significant copy of that
platform because that platform will break your program, there is a serious deficiency somewhere.
I get what its trying to solve, but its like someone using their forehead to bang nails into wood, and then "solves" the problem of a sore head by screwing
a metal plate to their forehead.
Tracker1 wrote to Dennisk <=-I
On 10/20/2020 6:13 PM, Dennisk wrote:
While I understand, that said the full package systems like flatpak
allow for dependencies to not be an issue and for complex application
sthat can be a big problem, especially with a distro upgrade, which
always blows up something in my experience.
These can be solved with better discipline and standards though. As much as
like Linux, Windows has an advantage here. Having that central controlmeans
that there is a better chance that you develop for one specific platform and have it work.
Okay, so you don't use the centrally managed/controlled package manager for your distro? And how does that jive with your specific platform
and have it work? Also, it means you're less likely to get
applications support on less popular distros.
I mean, if you don't care if actual people can get the applications
they actually need, that's fine, but it's not going to work for most people.
Flatpak means that Linux has failed as a platform. If you can't develop a program for that platform, without having to include a significant copy oftha
tscrewing
platform because that platform will break your program, there is a serious deficiency somewhere.
You act like Linux is a single platform... there are variances between versions and distros that cause and bring a *LOT* of variance. Have
you ever had to support Linux for software before? Did you limit
yourself to the main two distros only?
I get what its trying to solve, but its like someone using their forehead to bang nails into wood, and then "solves" the problem of a sore head by
a metal plate to their forehead.
Then create a better solution that works across differing linux distros
in a common way... Until then, it works well.
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